scratching my head as to what to do

[Blightersbane]

Im to make a 10th level arcane (mostly) based build. That is I am to focus on arcane but can freely pick from all class & sources other than ToB. Its a gestalt pc and I cant pick any tier 1 classes. I wanted to have some melee ability at least more than half bab progression.

Problem is deciding what to do when the door of opportunity is this wide open, I cant seem to focus my self. We usually have more restrictions or at least guidelines for party role. My role thus far is to be the "arcanist" with limited fighting ability and thats it. All prestige and classes open, please advise, as I am kind of in a rush, game night is friday.


a pre thanks guys n gals for any help/advice

Blightersbane

[Blightersbane]

one player mentioned a build that allows me to simulate that of an Arcane Archer. That build is sorcerer/warlock/eldritch theurge. Using the warlocks staple ability eb as my "bow n arrow" with the spellblast class feature of Eld Thrg. I know blasting isnt the most optimal but this looks like it could be fun, if not at least unique.

[wotmaniac]

Gestalt?  No T1?  Casting and melee?
My initial instinct is to use this as a starting base: Duskblade//[non-T1 full arcane caster].

For [non-T1 full arcane caster], you've sorcerer, beguiler, warmage, and dread necro.
Sorcerer is the most versatile, but leaves you MAD. 
Warmage and dread necro are way less versatile and leaves you similarly MAD; so I'd say those 2 are out.
Beguiler leaves you the least MAD (but still some, because you still need physical stats); and the lack of versatility is easily made up for with UMD and taking Shadow Conj/Evoc as your Adaptive Learning spells.  That's my pick.

I wouldn't necessarily take this to the bank, as this is just my initial instinct, and there are several other group-specific factors to consider.


By gestalt rules, Eldritch Theurge should be disqualified.

[Captnq]

So go check out the EVD Complete Base Class List. Allow me to select just the arcane casters for you.

BASE CLASS   TYPE   MSA   BAB   Fort   Ref   Will   Skills   HD   BOOK
EIDOLONCER   Arc/Div (Any)   9th   Poor   Poor   Poor   Good   2+Int   d6   GHOSTWALK (3.0)
SPELLCASTER   Arc/Div (Spont-Any)   9th   Poor   Var   Var   Var   2+Int   d4   UNEARTHED ARCANA (3.5)
SPELLTHIEF   Arcane   4th   Avg   Poor   Poor   Good   6+Int   d6   COMPLETE ADVENTURER (3.5)
MAGEWRIGHT (NPC)   Arcane (Prep-Int)   5th   Poor   Poor   Poor   Good   2+Int   d4   EBERRON CAMAPIGN SETTING (3.5)
WIZARD   Arcane (Prep-Int)   9th   Poor   Poor   Poor   Good   2+Int   d4   PLAYER’S HANDBOOK (3.5)
WU JEN   Arcane (Prep-Int)   9th   Poor   Poor   Poor   Good   2+Int   d4   COMPLETE ARCANE (3.5)
BARD   Arcane (Spont-Cha)   6th   Avg   Poor   Good   Good   6+Int   d6   PLAYER’S HANDBOOK (3.5)
DREAD NECROMANCER   Arcane (Spont-Cha)   9th   Poor   Poor   Poor   Good   2+Int   d6   HEROES OF HORROR (3.5)
HEXBLADE   Arcane (Spont-Cha)   4th   Good   Poor   Poor   Good   2+Int   d10   COMPLETE WARRIOR (3.5)
SORCERER   Arcane (Spont-Cha)   9th   Poor   Poor   Poor   Good   2+Int   d4   PLAYER’S HANDBOOK (3.5)
SPIRIT SHAMAN   Arcane (Spont-Cha)   9th   Avg   Good   Poor   Good   4+Int   d8   COMPLETE DIVINE (3.5)
WARMAGE   Arcane (Spont-Cha)   9th   Poor   Poor   Poor   Good   2+Int   d6   COMPLETE ARCANE (3.5)
BEGUILER   Arcane (Spont-Int)   9th   Poor   Poor   Poor   Good   6+Int   d6   PLAYER’S HANDBOOK 2 (3.5)
DUSKBLADE   Arcane (Spont-Int)   5th   Good   Good   Poor   Good   2+Int   d8   PLAYER’S HANDBOOK 2 (3.5)

Me? I'd go with Warlock/Hexblade, just because you get to be Mister Erious McDarkand of the insufficent light.

Or go with Mystic Ranger/Duskblade. Should be interesting.

[Baad Speeler]

Duskblade 20
For the other class, 20 levels of beguiler.

You have the same casting stat for both of your classes, you have all the versatility you need from UMD, (See if Know Stones/Rune Staffs are allowed) you will be able to keep up with the party's BDF's damage wise, and you will have Yes as a class skill. You will have 2 good saves, (Fort, and Will) 6 skill points a level, Full Bab, and a D8 hit die. Plus you will have the ability to cast your spells in light armor without spell failure.

See if your DM will allow your Medium Armor casting from Duskblade to apply to Beguiler, since the beguiler already gets light armor

[wotmaniac]

Um, CD Spirit Shaman is divine.

[ksbsnowowl]

I have a player with a 20th level Gestalt character he's played up from 5th level.  It was basically Beguiler 19/Mindbender 1//Barbarian 17/Duskblade 3, and he's had a blast with it. He's said on multiple occasions that it is his favorite character ever. I think a straight Duskblade//Beguiler would be a lot of fun.  Sprinkle in a few PrC levels to taste.

[Balvenie]

I ran a Duskblade//Beguiler and it was my favorite build, and character thus far.

Really the two classes shore up each others weak points and synergize at the same time. using arcane strike+knowledge devotion, with a drakehelm for a couple of extra spells known (or a runestaff) lets you do some awesome hits and capitalize on the utility that is the beguiler.  If you want to play a gnome (or have a non-racist DM) a shadowcraft//duskblade is potentially awesome.

just my 2cp but I played him as a lawful good know it all/playboy and it was an absolute blast


p.s. lawful good in his case meant legitimate rule due to a social contract whereupon the ruler was subject to the will of those ruled, and the laws imposed ala the Magna Carta

[JohnnyMayHymn]

Dread Necromancer // Binder
two kinds of DR, rebuking, medium BaB, some good spells, a wide variety of binder abilities , and plenty of shenanigans to be had
note:not required to be evil

Beguiler,(SCM)?// Wildshape Ranger, Master of Many Forms
don't worry about physical stats and being as squishy, MoMF has plenty of ex ability tricks to pull when your spells aren't cutting it against constructs and stuff

These two builds would give you a ton of options during play.  Swapping out the caster for Sorcerer will boost the raw power level at the cost of some options and not as flavorful IMO.

[Blightersbane]

I Duskblade and Beguiler are enjoyable classes, but been there n done that. I've decided to go where I have not gone before, boldy. And that is

1 warlock / sorcerer
2w /s
3w / s
4w / s
5 eldritch theurge / paladin
6et / p
7et / p
8et / ranger
9et / r
10 et / fighter

a charisma arcanist, milking cha synergy with paladin slight healing and great bonus to saves, ranger for bab, ref saves & skills, fighter for a feat or 1 more level of ranger ??? for ye'allmighty endurance feet. Im thinking of alternative area spells??

[ksbsnowowl]

Make sure Eldritch Theurge is okay with your DM.  Such PrC's are prohibited by the standard Gestalt rules.

Prestige classes that are essentially class combinations - such as the arcane trickster, mystic theurge, and eldritch knight - should be prohibited if you’re using gestalt classes, because they unduly complicate the game balance of what’s already a high-powered variant.

Emphasis mine.

[Blightersbane]

Make sure Eldritch Theurge is okay with your DM.  Such PrC's are prohibited by the standard Gestalt rules.

Prestige classes that are essentially class combinations - such as the arcane trickster, mystic theurge, and eldritch knight - should be prohibited if you’re using gestalt classes, because they unduly complicate the game balance of what’s already a high-powered variant.

Emphasis mine.

I think picking subpar classes such as this allows BEGS for a prestige class like this. Truth is the warlock is meh, and needs tweaking to remain competitive, even in a no tier 1 campaign.

NOW the strongest warlock build I have ever enjoyed was- warlock/rogue/assassin. Everything melded together very well - synergistic. Became a little boring but once the assassin spells started it became less tedious.

[TML]

Can you take LA as one side of the gestalt?

[Blightersbane]

Can you take LA as one side of the gestalt?

not in this campaign

[Baad Speeler]

Damn, because otherwise:

Step 1: Play a necropolitan
Step 2: Start cramming the evolved template on there as much as possible.
Step 3: Profit

Otherwise, I've played a Warmage/Beguiler. That was fun.

Also, there is a reason that Wizard/Factotem/Warblade are viewed as the holy trinity. Pick 2 of them and you have to try to suck.

Another idea is Duskblade/Feat Rogue. Full Bab, All good saves, Skill list=Yes (This means UMD), Fighter feats, D8 hit die, 8 skill points per level, improved evasion, and the ability to make all the dedicated martial combatants question their existence on the planet.