Author Topic: Archivist-based "Gish"  (Read 6432 times)

Offline Aliek

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Archivist-based "Gish"
« on: November 10, 2011, 10:32:09 PM »
Well, after gaining more info about knowledge devotion, I kinda liked the idea of stacking that and dark knowledge for a gish-like character. Thing is, I'm not too good at the gish part. What I'd be looking at would be having many turn pools to draw from and persist many buffs, along with using knowledge devo and dark knowledge for better hitting power.

All in all, the idea I have goes like this:

Archivist 5/Holt Warden 2/Cloistered Cleric 1(Could ge gotten earlier, tough)/Binder 1/Anima Mage 10/Dread Necro 1

Not entirely sure about races, but with two domains that grant turn pools, holt warden's rebuke plants, and both dread necro's rebuke undead and the cleric's turn undead, that'd be 5 pools. With 16 CHA and improved turning, that makes 50 turn undead attempts, and with tenebrous handling us one turn per persist, that makes 10 persisted spells.

I've in mind using Anyspell and Greater Anyspell to persist wraithstrike and thunder lance, along with bite of the werebear and some kind of polymorph into a stronger form, humanoid most likely.  Then, divine power, as my BAB would be down the drain, and still, 5 spells to persist away. I'm not too sure if I should count bard spells or not, but there's also this option, and that's not even accounting for extended persisted spells. That'd bring us to quite a big amount more.

"Core" feats would be academic priest, extend spell, persist spell, DMM:Persist, improved binding, improved turning. Knowledge devotion would be there, but I plan on swapping the cloistered cleric's knowledge domain for that. Able learner could be useful, too. Or a dragonwrought kobold.
I'll be having power attack from bite of the werebear, so that's also out. Some charging feats, maybe?

And then there's also another vestige to bind, as I'd have two of them, and I'm planning just on Tenebrous.

Of course, I'd be using the divine adaptation of anima mage. Also, if there is another PrC that could go well instead of it, I'd love to hear your opinions.

All in all, should have some extreme cheese potential but I don't plan on using all of that. I'd use polymorph for the stats, but not for extra spellcasting, as an example.

If the feats allow, I plan on taking the mother cyst feat, too. And maybe greater visage of the deity is also a good spell to persist. He'd be neutral, tough.

~Aliek
« Last Edit: November 10, 2011, 10:33:59 PM by Aliek »

Offline OblivionSmurf83

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Re: Archivist-based "Gish"
« Reply #1 on: November 11, 2011, 12:58:13 AM »
Will you get unlimited access to nightsticks?

Also, how much flexibility will you get in gaining spells? Every Sor/Wiz spell up to level 6 is a Divine spell somewhere, thanks to one of the Favored Soul's ACFs.

Offline Aliek

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Re: Archivist-based "Gish"
« Reply #2 on: November 11, 2011, 10:06:42 AM »
I'm not too sure if nightsticks would be allowed, but if they do, I'm sure they won't stack.

About spells, divine spellcasting lists plus domains. Wiz/sorc spells should be there only if they appear on a domain, or by anyspell/greater anyspell/miracle. Bard spells I'm not too sure how a case could be made, for I've looked at the ol' BG's top 10 persistable divine spells and there was some bard ones in there, but idk if that's just the divine bard ACF or something else.

Offline OblivionSmurf83

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Re: Archivist-based "Gish"
« Reply #3 on: November 11, 2011, 11:50:12 AM »
Hmm, well, you should take the Azurin racial substitution level for your Cloistered Cleric, and add in Sacred Exorcist, for a bit of extra turning.

Offline Mooncrow

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Re: Archivist-based "Gish"
« Reply #4 on: November 11, 2011, 12:05:52 PM »
Hmm, well, you should take the Azurin racial substitution level for your Cloistered Cleric, and add in Sacred Exorcist, for a bit of extra turning.

You'll have to take the Rebuke Dragons cleric ACF for Sacred Exorcist to add additional turning to the cleric, and since that PrC is "any good" and Dread Necro is "any non-good" you won't be able to have both. 

Offline X-Codes

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Re: Archivist-based "Gish"
« Reply #5 on: November 11, 2011, 12:41:34 PM »
I'm not too sure if nightsticks would be allowed, but if they do, I'm sure they won't stack.
I would avoid the multi-pool approach to DMM: Persist, too, then.  IMO make the whole thing a little easier on yourself and be an Illumian, that way it's just 12 turn attempts to persist 2 spells, and then excess turn attempts can be used to boost your CL via Divine Spell Power (which is an extremely under-utilized feat, IMO, especially with long-duration buffs) and that's more than enough for your concept.

About spells, divine spellcasting lists plus domains. Wiz/sorc spells should be there only if they appear on a domain, or by anyspell/greater anyspell/miracle. Bard spells I'm not too sure how a case could be made, for I've looked at the ol' BG's top 10 persistable divine spells and there was some bard ones in there, but idk if that's just the divine bard ACF or something else.
Divine spells and domains are obvious.  Bard spells are the Divine Bard list.  The Sor/Wiz list can come from a few sources; I think the 3.0 Hexer PrC is the most obvious, although (Greater) Anyspell grabs a bunch.  Miracle doesn't work because you use Miracle to emulate the spell, you don't actually cast the spell in question.  I don't recall how to get the Sorcerer only spells, though.

As for your build, if you really want Dark Knowledge/Knowledge Devotion, then it's perfectly acceptable to just go Archivist 11 and then PrC into something else.  Maybe by that time in your campaign you'll know a specific variety of enemy you'll go up against over and over and you'll want to play some variant of the Keeper of the Cerulean Sign re-flavored against that specific type (or subtype) of enemies.

Offline Mooncrow

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Re: Archivist-based "Gish"
« Reply #6 on: November 11, 2011, 12:50:19 PM »
Divine spells and domains are obvious.  Bard spells are the Divine Bard list.  The Sor/Wiz list can come from a few sources; I think the 3.0 Hexer PrC is the most obvious, although (Greater) Anyspell grabs a bunch.  Miracle doesn't work because you use Miracle to emulate the spell, you don't actually cast the spell in question.  I don't recall how to get the Sorcerer only spells, though.


Sorc only is tricky - Favored Soul of Bahumet/Tiamat will let you get up to 6th level, for the higher ones, you need either Southern MagicianRoF, or Alternate Spell SourceDragon 325, though Southern Magician is kind of iffy if you can use it to make scrolls, and alternate spell source only mentions "preparing spells" in the text (though not in the requirements).  So, a little tricky either way. 

Offline KellKheraptis

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Re: Archivist-based "Gish"
« Reply #7 on: November 11, 2011, 12:59:40 PM »
Don't forget abusing Anima Mage's automatic metamagic mechanic, especially when you can use it once per round with a persistent Heroic Surge.  Also, you can abuse Acorn of Far Travel to a temple of Mystra, netting one free metamagic per spell.

Offline Aliek

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Re: Archivist-based "Gish"
« Reply #8 on: November 11, 2011, 01:54:30 PM »
I see. Well, my main schtick with being neutral was about anima mage, else I'd take sacred exorcist. I could probably do with just 5 levels of anima mage, and some knight of the raven, tough. I'd be losing a spellcaster level tough, so I'd have to ditch either dread necro or cloistered cleric, so that wouldn't really help. Same kinda goes for tenebrous apostate. Getting unfettered heroism to persist sounds quite challenging,  but that'd clear my problems with turn pools, as long as I don't go too overboard with persisting around. So I'd ditch that dread necro level, and get some devotions with the cleric level. Could do with greater anyspell, for heroism. Yeah, I'll look at that.
So... Two free levels now, with dread necro and one holt warden level dropped. That opens up some options.

~Aliek