Author Topic: Paragon  (Read 66288 times)

Offline phaedrusxy

  • DnD Handbook Writer
  • ****
  • Posts: 10717
  • The iconic spambot
    • View Profile
Re: Paragon
« Reply #40 on: April 15, 2012, 12:14:57 AM »
What kind of action is it to spend potential points? And can you do it after you know the results of a roll? Or do you have to declare it before you roll?
I don't pee messages into the snow often , but when I do , it's in Cyrillic with Fake Viagra.  Stay frosty my friends.

Offline oslecamo

  • Honorary Mod
  • *****
  • Posts: 10080
  • Creating monsters for my Realm of Darkness
    • View Profile
    • Oslecamo's Custom Library (my homebrew)
Re: Paragon
« Reply #41 on: April 15, 2012, 05:43:12 PM »
No action needed, you need to do it before knowing the result. Clarified both.

Offline phaedrusxy

  • DnD Handbook Writer
  • ****
  • Posts: 10717
  • The iconic spambot
    • View Profile
Re: Paragon
« Reply #42 on: April 20, 2012, 11:39:25 PM »
It seems entirely possible to not qualify for any greater excellences when you reach the level to choose one... For example, I'm planning on taking Paragon Rage, Paragon Warrior, and Paragon Athletics. What do I do about a Greater Excellence when I hit 6th level? I could trade out Paragon Athletics for something more useful, but it is just damned cool... and I'm not sure how it could be improved as a Greater version, either.

What about allowing someone to choose two more "lesser" excellences instead of a Greater one?
I don't pee messages into the snow often , but when I do , it's in Cyrillic with Fake Viagra.  Stay frosty my friends.

Offline oslecamo

  • Honorary Mod
  • *****
  • Posts: 10080
  • Creating monsters for my Realm of Darkness
    • View Profile
    • Oslecamo's Custom Library (my homebrew)
Re: Paragon
« Reply #43 on: April 21, 2012, 07:09:37 AM »
Paragon athletics unlocks Paragon Shot and Quicksilver Dodge Greater Excellences.

Added three new greater excellences, Paragon Blade and Paragon Training for some more ToB love, and Paragon Fury for extra rage improvement.

Also two new Perfect Excellences, Paragon Wrath and Can You Weaklings Not Fight Any Better for more improvement of Rage and ToB.


Offline phaedrusxy

  • DnD Handbook Writer
  • ****
  • Posts: 10717
  • The iconic spambot
    • View Profile
Re: Paragon
« Reply #44 on: April 21, 2012, 10:27:03 PM »
Paragon athletics unlocks Paragon Shot and Quicksilver Dodge Greater Excellences.
Paragon Shot is a normal (not Greater) Excellence. Paragon Acrobatics unlocks Quicksilver Dodge, not Paragon Athletics. Hence my earlier conundrum. :D

Quote from: oslecamo
Added three new greater excellences, Paragon Blade and Paragon Training for some more ToB love, and Paragon Fury for extra rage improvement.

Also two new Perfect Excellences, Paragon Wrath and Can You Weaklings Not Fight Any Better for more improvement of Rage and ToB.
Awesome. I especially like Paragon Fury. :D
I don't pee messages into the snow often , but when I do , it's in Cyrillic with Fake Viagra.  Stay frosty my friends.

Offline Quillwraith

  • Hero Member
  • ***
  • Posts: 867
    • View Profile
Re: Paragon
« Reply #45 on: April 21, 2012, 10:56:43 PM »
This be's cool.

Some things I think ought be changed, though:

You remove all ill effects from yourself (except death) and all squares adjacent to you, such as magic area effects, puting out fires and breaking ice.
Define 'ill effects'! Like iron heart surge didn't!
Also, how do you pute out a fire?

Paragon Wrath-You need Paragon Fury to pick this Greater Excellence.

. . .

You gain new maneuvers known, maneuvers readied, maneuvers swapped and stances known as if you had gained two new levels in a martial class you belonged to before taking this Greater Excellence.
These are perfect excellences (not greater).

Offline oslecamo

  • Honorary Mod
  • *****
  • Posts: 10080
  • Creating monsters for my Realm of Darkness
    • View Profile
    • Oslecamo's Custom Library (my homebrew)
Re: Paragon
« Reply #46 on: April 22, 2012, 07:04:27 PM »
Paragon athletics unlocks Paragon Shot and Quicksilver Dodge Greater Excellences.
Paragon Shot is a normal (not Greater) Excellence. Paragon Acrobatics unlocks Quicksilver Dodge, not Paragon Athletics. Hence my earlier conundrum. :D

Ouch, I meant Paragon Bombardment, that can be taken with Paragon Atlhetics.

Quillwraith:I'm not being paid enough to define "ill effects", in particular when ToB itself doesn't. If it's good enough for its fans, it's good enough for here. As for how you put out fires, I picture it as those Hulk comics where he roars/claps his hands and the shockwaves extinguish flames.

Also fixed the greater/perfect thingy.

Offline Quillwraith

  • Hero Member
  • ***
  • Posts: 867
    • View Profile
Re: Paragon
« Reply #47 on: April 22, 2012, 07:40:08 PM »

Quillwraith:I'm not being paid enough to define "ill effects", in particular when ToB itself doesn't.
You can basically copypasta the 'sage advice' on it, with a little editing:

Instantaneous effects can’t be removed by this ability. However, any effect with a specified duration may be removed by this ability, with the exception of damage, ability burn, or ability drain.

Or limit it to things in the condition summary.

As for how you put out fires, I picture it as those Hulk comics where he roars/claps his hands and the shockwaves extinguish flames.
I wrote 'pute', rather than put, as a way of indirectly pointing out a misspelling. I probably should have made that clearer.

Offline DavidWL

  • Hero Member
  • ***
  • Posts: 506
    • View Profile
Re: Paragon
« Reply #48 on: May 28, 2012, 10:35:30 PM »
First of all, awesome class.

Questions and clarifications below.

Paragon Block: While wielding a shield, you gain a chance to “Block” any attack against you depending on the type (10% for a buckler, 20% for a light shield, 40% for a heavy shield, 60% for a tower shield). Your shield can even protect you from area attacks with the Block chance, altough it doesn't stop it from affecting others. By spending one Potential point as a free action, you can extend this Block chance to adjacent allies for 1 round as you cover them with your shield. This doesn't stack with other sources of Block and/or miss chances, and you must actually wield the shield to gain it (animated doesn't work). You need proficiency with the relevant shield to use this ability.

1)  By block an "attack", I assume this means melee/ranged?  But not, for example, a fireball?  Or disintegrate?

Also, mis-spelling bolded above.

Quote
Paragon Stealth:[/u]You need 8 ranks in Hide and Move Silently to pick this Excellence. You can take 10 in Hide and Move Silently checks even if threatened or rushed. In addition you can atempt to hide whitout actually having anything to hide behind! If you already had a similar ability (invisibility magic won't do, but a Ranger's Camouphlage or a Shadowdancer's Hide In Plain Sight would), you may atempt a Hide and Move Silently check as an immediate action while observed. Double the bonus you gain from using Potential points for Hide and Move Silently checks.

Just to be clear - hiding while observed or as an immediate action has no extra penalties, correct?  I'm pretty sure that's the case. 

And, this improved hide ability is not dependent on any other constraints (Example:  If you can "Hide in Plain Sight" in shadows without this ability, with this ability you can hide regardless of environment).

Mis-spellings bolded.

Quote
Paragon Break: You need Improved Sunder to pick this Excellence. Whenever you attack an enemy in melee, you may make a Sunder atempt on that same enemy as a free action. You can also sunder stationary magic effects (aka any area non-instantaneous magic effect not on a specific creature) as long as you're wielding a magic weapon. Force effects count as having 6 HP per CL and all other magic effects count as having 3 HP per CL. Double the bonus you gain from using Potential points for Sunder atempts and damage.

No "to-hit" roll to attack stationary magic effects?

Quote
Paragon Proficiency: You need proficiency with all martial weapons, heavy armor and at least 1 Exotic weapon to pick this Excellence. You gain proficiency with all Exotic weapons, and the saving DC of any effect created by magic weapons wielded by the Paragon becomes (10 + ½ HD + Highest Mental Stat mod) if it is higher than the standard DC. Effects which duplicate spells have a caster level equal to his HD if that is higher than normal (recalculate damage, duration, etc. as appropriate). Increase the enhancement bonus of any weapon wielded by the Paragon by 1; he may treat nonmagical weapons as +1 weapons. Plus  armor no longer slows down your movement speed or limits your max Dex bonus to AC. Whenever you spend Paragon Points for anything, you gain DR X/- for 1 round, where X is the amount of Paragon points spent. This stacks with itself, or can be used to boost already existing DR, in which case it becomes DR of that type. So for example if you had DR 3/adamantine and spent 5 Paragon Points, you could either gain DR 5/-, or improve to DR 8/adamantine.

Do these bonuses also apply to non-weapons?  For example, a ring of freedom of movement normally has a CL of 7.  Does this set the CL = HD?

Quote
You Owe Me: [/u]You need 8 ranks in Gather Information and Diplomacy to learn this Excellence. You've acumulated quite a number of favors during your life, and you now know somebody in every place that knows somebody else that can get  things done. As long as you're in a relatively populated area, you can always sell gear at full price instead of half, and commission any single item worth up to 500 GP per rank you have in Gather Information and Diplomacy to be delivered to your person in 24 hours (you still must pay the item's full cost). In addition while in a populated area you can requistion the services of an NPC of your choice of an alignment equal to yours of a level up to (the lowest number of ranks you have in Diplomacy or Gather Information)-5. It obeys you to the best of its ability, but you must spend Potential Points every hour equal to its HD to keep it under your control, otherwise it leaves. If you take or lose the NPC's gear, you lose all benefits of this Excellence for 1 year and 1 day as you rebuild your web of favors.  You can always take 10 in gather Information and Diplomacy checks even if rushed or threatened. Double the bonus you gain from using Potential points for Gather Information and Diplomacy checks.

The NPC - is this like a cohort, and can have actual class levels, unusual races, etc.?  Or is this an NPC in the sense of "Commoner/Expert/Adept/Warrior"?

If the NPC dies, and you return the NPC's gear to next of Kin, does the ability continue to function without penalty?

Quote
Paragon Infiltration: You need Paragon Stealth or Paragon Manipulation to pick this Greater Excellence. When traveling, you don't need to specify where your character is as long as you don't take any specific actions. At any moment during an ally's turn, you may show up in any position in that ally's field of view and act on his iniative before rolling your own. You were there all along! Whenever you sucesfully hide again, you may “disapear” once more in your own turn as a move action, but cannot “appear” again until the next round. In addition 1/round you may use a Sleight of Hand check instead of an attack roll or Physical Ability score check, and 1/round you may atempt to Feint an enemy as a free action.

My favorite excellence.  So very cool.

Lots of Questions:

1)  When you "act on his initiative before rolling your own".  Does this mean you act on his initiative, then again on your own?

2)  When you "disappear" after a successful hide attempt ... does this mean you have to beat all observers?  (Example:  3 groups watch you - orcs attacking you, a neutral wizard via scrying, and your party).  Do you have to hide from all 3 groups to use this ability?

3)  Does this mean you can go anywhere without detection?  You are traveling through a dungeon, and as long as you don't interact with the environment too much, nothing happens to you?  If your party is caught in a big trap, can you specify "I was ahead or behind them", and thus were not caught?

Quote
Forged by Experience: You need one of Paragon Proficiency, Paragon Dual Wield, Paragon Fencing, Paragon Block or Paragon Shot to pick this greater excellence.  The Paragon can enchant parts of his body as magic items, as if he had the relevant item creation feat and a caster level equal to his HD. The Paragon cannot emulate an item creation feat with a caster level requirement higher than his class HD, or create an item with a limited number of uses. These items take up body slots as normal (but see below). The Paragon may dismantle an "item" created in this manner in 8 hours, regaining the expended gp and freeing up the slot once more. If the Paragon doesn't know any spells himself, he may use scrolls or have a caster assist them. On the DM's judgement, parts of monsters or specially exotic substances may also work.

Does this take normal item crafting time?  Does this cost as normal?

Example: 

I craft a ring of freedom of movement with CL 7 and it costs me 40K.  I use it with CL 20 with Paragon Proficiency.

However, if I use this, and craft the same ring, do I need to craft it with CL 20 (costing much more gold) to get the same effect?  Can I use the benefits of Paragon Proficiency with these enchantments?

Quote
Tactical Genius-[/u]When your enemy thinks they've ambushed you, your allies are suddenly standing on the perfect positions to counter them. You need Forged by Experience or Paragon Infiltration to pick this Perfect Excellence. At the start of each combat, as soon as you roll iniative, you and your allies can take a free move or non-offensive swift action that can't be reacted to in any way.

This can be any move action?

Quote
That Was Left Handed: [/i]You're so good you can perform incredible tasks even with your off-hand while holding something else with it! At 12th once per round as a free action even if it isn't your turn, you may perform either a physical attack, basic move action or one of your Know The Trick SLAs.

What is a "basic move action"?  Does initiating a manuever that is an attack count as a "physical attack"?

Thanks again!  Very cool Class :)

Best,
David

P.S.  I may post a couple of builds in this thread (unless you object).

Offline oslecamo

  • Honorary Mod
  • *****
  • Posts: 10080
  • Creating monsters for my Realm of Darkness
    • View Profile
    • Oslecamo's Custom Library (my homebrew)
Re: Paragon
« Reply #49 on: May 30, 2012, 02:55:02 PM »
Disclaimer: I don't really have time to take care of mispellings unless they would result in serious crunch doubts. If you want, you can make a "cleaned" version yourself and I'll edit it in.

Paragon Block: While wielding a shield, you gain a chance to “Block” any attack against you depending on the type (10% for a buckler, 20% for a light shield, 40% for a heavy shield, 60% for a tower shield). Your shield can even protect you from area attacks with the Block chance, altough it doesn't stop it from affecting others. By spending one Potential point as a free action, you can extend this Block chance to adjacent allies for 1 round as you cover them with your shield. This doesn't stack with other sources of Block and/or miss chances, and you must actually wield the shield to gain it (animated doesn't work). You need proficiency with the relevant shield to use this ability.

1)  By block an "attack", I assume this means melee/ranged?  But not, for example, a fireball?  Or disintegrate?
[/quote]
It can block anything that would cause you harm and comes from another source than yourself, that's why it says "even area attacks".

Quote
Paragon Stealth:[/u]You need 8 ranks in Hide and Move Silently to pick this Excellence. You can take 10 in Hide and Move Silently checks even if threatened or rushed. In addition you can atempt to hide whitout actually having anything to hide behind! If you already had a similar ability (invisibility magic won't do, but a Ranger's Camouphlage or a Shadowdancer's Hide In Plain Sight would), you may atempt a Hide and Move Silently check as an immediate action while observed. Double the bonus you gain from using Potential points for Hide and Move Silently checks.

Just to be clear - hiding while observed or as an immediate action has no extra penalties, correct?  I'm pretty sure that's the case. 

And, this improved hide ability is not dependent on any other constraints (Example:  If you can "Hide in Plain Sight" in shadows without this ability, with this ability you can hide regardless of environment).
Yes to both, clarified.


Quote
Paragon Break: You need Improved Sunder to pick this Excellence. Whenever you attack an enemy in melee, you may make a Sunder atempt on that same enemy as a free action. You can also sunder stationary magic effects (aka any area non-instantaneous magic effect not on a specific creature) as long as you're wielding a magic weapon. Force effects count as having 6 HP per CL and all other magic effects count as having 3 HP per CL. Double the bonus you gain from using Potential points for Sunder atempts and damage.

No "to-hit" roll to attack stationary magic effects?
No, if you can miss hiting a wall /fog, then you have no business being a Paragon. :P

Quote
Paragon Proficiency: You need proficiency with all martial weapons, heavy armor and at least 1 Exotic weapon to pick this Excellence. You gain proficiency with all Exotic weapons, and the saving DC of any effect created by magic weapons wielded by the Paragon becomes (10 + ½ HD + Highest Mental Stat mod) if it is higher than the standard DC. Effects which duplicate spells have a caster level equal to his HD if that is higher than normal (recalculate damage, duration, etc. as appropriate). Increase the enhancement bonus of any weapon wielded by the Paragon by 1; he may treat nonmagical weapons as +1 weapons. Plus  armor no longer slows down your movement speed or limits your max Dex bonus to AC. Whenever you spend Paragon Points for anything, you gain DR X/- for 1 round, where X is the amount of Paragon points spent. This stacks with itself, or can be used to boost already existing DR, in which case it becomes DR of that type. So for example if you had DR 3/adamantine and spent 5 Paragon Points, you could either gain DR 5/-, or improve to DR 8/adamantine.

Do these bonuses also apply to non-weapons?  For example, a ring of freedom of movement normally has a CL of 7.  Does this set the CL = HD?
Only magic weapons.

Quote
You Owe Me: [/u]You need 8 ranks in Gather Information and Diplomacy to learn this Excellence. You've acumulated quite a number of favors during your life, and you now know somebody in every place that knows somebody else that can get  things done. As long as you're in a relatively populated area, you can always sell gear at full price instead of half, and commission any single item worth up to 500 GP per rank you have in Gather Information and Diplomacy to be delivered to your person in 24 hours (you still must pay the item's full cost). In addition while in a populated area you can requistion the services of an NPC of your choice of an alignment equal to yours of a level up to (the lowest number of ranks you have in Diplomacy or Gather Information)-5. It obeys you to the best of its ability, but you must spend Potential Points every hour equal to its HD to keep it under your control, otherwise it leaves. If you take or lose the NPC's gear, you lose all benefits of this Excellence for 1 year and 1 day as you rebuild your web of favors.  You can always take 10 in gather Information and Diplomacy checks even if rushed or threatened. Double the bonus you gain from using Potential points for Gather Information and Diplomacy checks.

The NPC - is this like a cohort, and can have actual class levels, unusual races, etc.?  Or is this an NPC in the sense of "Commoner/Expert/Adept/Warrior"?

If the NPC dies, and you return the NPC's gear to next of Kin, does the ability continue to function without penalty?
It is a cohort that can have exotic stuff, but it's the DM that builds it. Returning the NPC's gear to the next of kin whitin 24 hours sounds reasonable. Clarified both.

Quote
Paragon Infiltration: You need Paragon Stealth or Paragon Manipulation to pick this Greater Excellence. When traveling, you don't need to specify where your character is as long as you don't take any specific actions. At any moment during an ally's turn, you may show up in any position in that ally's field of view and act on his iniative before rolling your own. You were there all along! Whenever you sucesfully hide again, you may “disapear” once more in your own turn as a move action, but cannot “appear” again until the next round. In addition 1/round you may use a Sleight of Hand check instead of an attack roll or Physical Ability score check, and 1/round you may atempt to Feint an enemy as a free action.

My favorite excellence.  So very cool.

Lots of Questions:

1)  When you "act on his initiative before rolling your own".  Does this mean you act on his initiative, then again on your own?

2)  When you "disappear" after a successful hide attempt ... does this mean you have to beat all observers?  (Example:  3 groups watch you - orcs attacking you, a neutral wizard via scrying, and your party).  Do you have to hide from all 3 groups to use this ability?

3)  Does this mean you can go anywhere without detection?  You are traveling through a dungeon, and as long as you don't interact with the environment too much, nothing happens to you?  If your party is caught in a big trap, can you specify "I was ahead or behind them", and thus were not caught?
1) Yes if your rolled iniative is lower than your ally.
2)Your allies can choose to ignore you, but you would need to beat the orcs and wizard.
3) Yes, but you can't perform any actions until you declare your position.

Quote
Forged by Experience: You need one of Paragon Proficiency, Paragon Dual Wield, Paragon Fencing, Paragon Block or Paragon Shot to pick this greater excellence.  The Paragon can enchant parts of his body as magic items, as if he had the relevant item creation feat and a caster level equal to his HD. The Paragon cannot emulate an item creation feat with a caster level requirement higher than his class HD, or create an item with a limited number of uses. These items take up body slots as normal (but see below). The Paragon may dismantle an "item" created in this manner in 8 hours, regaining the expended gp and freeing up the slot once more. If the Paragon doesn't know any spells himself, he may use scrolls or have a caster assist them. On the DM's judgement, parts of monsters or specially exotic substances may also work.

Does this take normal item crafting time?  Does this cost as normal?

Example: 

I craft a ring of freedom of movement with CL 7 and it costs me 40K.  I use it with CL 20 with Paragon Proficiency.

However, if I use this, and craft the same ring, do I need to craft it with CL 20 (costing much more gold) to get the same effect?  Can I use the benefits of Paragon Proficiency with these enchantments?
You can reduce your caster level for crafting purposes. And as clarifiedd earlier, Paragon Proficiency doesn't work with non-weapons. I guess you could make your fists a Dazing weapon and then its DC would be increased by Paragon Proficiency.

Quote
Tactical Genius-[/u]When your enemy thinks they've ambushed you, your allies are suddenly standing on the perfect positions to counter them. You need Forged by Experience or Paragon Infiltration to pick this Perfect Excellence. At the start of each combat, as soon as you roll iniative, you and your allies can take a free move or non-offensive swift action that can't be reacted to in any way.

This can be any move action?
Yes.

Quote
That Was Left Handed: [/i]You're so good you can perform incredible tasks even with your off-hand while holding something else with it! At 12th once per round as a free action even if it isn't your turn, you may perform either a physical attack, basic move action or one of your Know The Trick SLAs.

What is a "basic move action"?  Does initiating a manuever that is an attack count as a "physical attack"?

Basic move action, well, is moving up to your base speed. And that was suposed to be a basic physical attack, clarified.

Thanks again!  Very cool Class :)

Best,
David

P.S.  I may post a couple of builds in this thread (unless you object).
You're welcome. And yes, sample builds would be pretty nice. Extra points if you actually use a monster class to enter it, altough most people around here seem to think about this as an "omni-prc" for base classes. Myself included I guess since I used the two pimped knight pictures.:p

Offline Rakoa

  • Sr. Member
  • ***
  • Posts: 356
  • No Problem
    • View Profile
Re: Paragon
« Reply #50 on: June 02, 2012, 06:47:54 PM »
First off, let me say, this is by far one of the best monster classes ever just because the options are amazing in potential. The WTF moments caused by this is great, when PCs and NPCs alike can't understand just how this character pulls certain things off. I really like the idea of being able to use this class as a fallback to avoid multiclassing into something you may not want to multiclass into and risk either your combat style or your characters "feel", if you know what I mean.

I picked up on a few errors, however. Here they are.  :)

Paragon Will: When you spend Potential points in a Will save, double the bonus gained. You don't fail Will saves in a natural 1 anymore, and you're immune to effects that would force you to take actions you don't want to take (but not effects that simply prevent you from taking any actions at all, like death).You need Iron Will to pick this option. Double the bonus gained from Potential Points spent to boost Will saves.
The bolded part shows the repeated text, at the beginning and then at the end. I think it only needs to be mentioned once. The same thing is done in Paragon Reflexes and Paragon Fortitude.

The One:You're special, there's no doubt of that. Things that would greatly hinder your normal kin are barely noticed by you.   At 2nd level the Paragon gains resistance to two elements of his choice (stacking with any other resistances he already had) and DR/magic equal to half his HD. If the Paragon already had a DR with magic as a bypassing component, then increase it by 5.
The bolded part shows the mention of energy resistances, but there is no mention of what amount of resistances you get.

Thats all for now. Thanks for the class here, I am in the process of creating a Master Fencer.  :D
The Paladin Code: Detect Evil, Smite it, ask questions later.

Offline oslecamo

  • Honorary Mod
  • *****
  • Posts: 10080
  • Creating monsters for my Realm of Darkness
    • View Profile
    • Oslecamo's Custom Library (my homebrew)
Re: Paragon
« Reply #51 on: June 04, 2012, 09:22:40 PM »
Paragon Will: When you spend Potential points in a Will save, double the bonus gained. You don't fail Will saves in a natural 1 anymore, and you're immune to effects that would force you to take actions you don't want to take (but not effects that simply prevent you from taking any actions at all, like death).You need Iron Will to pick this option. Double the bonus gained from Potential Points spent to boost Will saves.
The bolded part shows the repeated text, at the beginning and then at the end. I think it only needs to be mentioned once. The same thing is done in Paragon Reflexes and Paragon Fortitude.
Fixed, thanks.

The One:You're special, there's no doubt of that. Things that would greatly hinder your normal kin are barely noticed by you.   At 2nd level the Paragon gains resistance to two elements of his choice (stacking with any other resistances he already had) and DR/magic equal to half his HD. If the Paragon already had a DR with magic as a bypassing component, then increase it by 5.
The bolded part shows the mention of energy resistances, but there is no mention of what amount of resistances you get.

Thats all for now. Thanks for the class here, I am in the process of creating a Master Fencer.  :D
Both the resistances and DR/magic are equal to 1/2 HD.

And if possible  share your build with us!

Offline Rakoa

  • Sr. Member
  • ***
  • Posts: 356
  • No Problem
    • View Profile
Re: Paragon
« Reply #52 on: June 04, 2012, 10:54:48 PM »
I'll definitely give it a shot. I'll let you know what I chose, and perhaps can get some help making him more fencer like.  :P
The Paladin Code: Detect Evil, Smite it, ask questions later.

Offline phaedrusxy

  • DnD Handbook Writer
  • ****
  • Posts: 10717
  • The iconic spambot
    • View Profile
Re: Paragon
« Reply #53 on: June 04, 2012, 11:05:02 PM »
I'm trying it out here, but it is mixed up with a lot of other homebrew, and doesn't involve a monster class.
I don't pee messages into the snow often , but when I do , it's in Cyrillic with Fake Viagra.  Stay frosty my friends.

Offline Rakoa

  • Sr. Member
  • ***
  • Posts: 356
  • No Problem
    • View Profile
Re: Paragon
« Reply #54 on: June 04, 2012, 11:08:18 PM »
I'll look over yours more carefully when I get the chance, because yours might work better. I was lazy and didn't want to look through ten bazillion sourcebooks, and then homebrew on top of that, to find a fencer-type base class and just went with fighter 5, paragon 5 or something.
The Paladin Code: Detect Evil, Smite it, ask questions later.

Offline Rakoa

  • Sr. Member
  • ***
  • Posts: 356
  • No Problem
    • View Profile
Re: Paragon
« Reply #55 on: June 06, 2012, 05:10:12 PM »
Alright, got my sheet here! As I said before, I was too lazy to search for a more fencer like base class, so he is just a fighter5. I gave him 5 levels in paragon, and took 3 excellences as Paragon Fencing (of course), Paragon Combat (definitely fits) and Paragon Reflexes (I think it fits). I took Haste as his SLA, because come on, super fast lightning awesome sword strikes are perfect. For feats, I had a lot to choose from (1 for first level, 1 for human, 3 for levels, 3 fighter bonuses). I went with Weapon Focus (Rapier), Weapon Specialization (Rapier), Improved Critical (Rapier), Weapon Finesse (Rapier), Combat Reflexes, Lightning Reflexes, and Leadership.

Stat increases went all Dex and Cha, as I wanted Leadership to be pretty awesome. I was thinking of going for Str and Cha, dropping rapier and taking up the longsword (replacing the appropriate feats with longsword, of course) but figured the rapier was more stereotypical of a fencer dude. I have yet to get a greater excellence (next level, if I ever even get a chance to use this guy).

So what do you guys think? Any advice for me good old fencer?
The Paladin Code: Detect Evil, Smite it, ask questions later.

Offline Nanshork

  • Homebrew Reviewer
  • Administrator
  • *****
  • Posts: 13401
    • View Profile
Re: Paragon
« Reply #56 on: June 06, 2012, 05:46:59 PM »
If you want a fencer take a look at the Nimblewright.

Offline Rakoa

  • Sr. Member
  • ***
  • Posts: 356
  • No Problem
    • View Profile
Re: Paragon
« Reply #57 on: June 06, 2012, 06:08:05 PM »
Sweet jumping crap, it has rapiers for hands! If that fit with my character's backstory, I would be all over that  :clap
The Paladin Code: Detect Evil, Smite it, ask questions later.

Offline DavidWL

  • Hero Member
  • ***
  • Posts: 506
    • View Profile
Re: Paragon
« Reply #58 on: June 11, 2012, 06:14:39 AM »
*** THOUGHTS ***

12th level feat: Leadership: Fiend of Possession Bard cohort - (Song of the Heart / Words of Creation / Focused Performance / Extended Performance)
*Inspire Greatness --> +2 HD
*(Ispire Greatness +2, Song of the Heart +1) * 2 ( Words of Creation ) * 2 (Focused Performance)
*There is a bard feat (don't remember which) which makes a song last an amount of time equal to the time you were singing (can be all day!)
=> +12 HD all day long ... boosts CL, DCs, etc.

Sharn 5/Paragon 15
* CL = 3 + 14 = Sorcerer/Favored Sould 17, with other awesomeness. 
* Paragon Magic --> DC at 20th = 20 + highest mental stat +14 to highest stat --> +7 to DCs
--> Brutal Spell DCs
* Much better than mystic theurge.  Amusingly enough, balanced vs. a strong full caster, but very cool.

I'd like to throw in a Dvati, perhaps with the last build sketch.

Very feat hungry

Amusingly, the Perfect Excellences are the least interesting.

Also, amusingly enough, this class really is balanced with a high-powered full caster Prestige Class

*** HD/CL Equivlance ToB / Ardent ***

Summary:  Uses Paragon Warrior/Psionics to snatch level-equivalent powers from both ToB (Scholar, etc.) and Ardent.  Uses Bloodlines to accelerate power and manuever selection.

bloodline 3
Scholar 1 (Plain History)/Ardent 1

Ardent: ACF: Substitute powers/augment to 10
   Time - syncronicity, hustle, Quintessence
   Mental might - schism, psychic reformation
   Generous use of knowstones
   Possible Psycrystal trickery

Feats   
   Practiced Manifester

Excellence - Paragon Warrior
Excellence - Paragon Fighting Style
Excellence - Paragon Psionics

Greater Excellence - Paragon Psionicist
Greater Excellence - Paragon Training
Greater Excellence -

Perfect Excellence - Can You Weaklings Not Fight Any Better
Perfect Excellence - Paragon Mind
Perfect Excellence -

*** SUPER SNEAK + ITEM UER ***


Some way to hide in plain sight (Shadow Creature, etc.)

Feats:
   Mercantine Background
   Darkstalker
   Needs a way to qualify for Paragon Proficiency ... example: Otherworldly Strongheart Halfling

Excellence - Paragon Stealth:  Best way to not be hurt is not seen
Excellence - Paragon Proficiency:  I've seen a weapon with the ability to turn into something innocent ... like a ring or a vest ... etc.  His magic items now are all at full HD
Excellence - You Owe Me:  But at 75% (Mercantile), sell at 100%. + Semi Custom Cohorts

Greater Excellence - Paragon Infiltration: Now really can't be attacked, and/or an extra ~turn every other turn
« Last Edit: June 11, 2012, 06:25:08 AM by DavidWL »

Offline oslecamo

  • Honorary Mod
  • *****
  • Posts: 10080
  • Creating monsters for my Realm of Darkness
    • View Profile
    • Oslecamo's Custom Library (my homebrew)
Re: Paragon
« Reply #59 on: June 12, 2012, 06:08:42 AM »
Amusingly, the Perfect Excellences are the least interesting.

I got that vibe from some other critiques around here, but would you care about being more specific about what makes them less interesting? Are they interesting by themselves?

Also I'm not responsible for any shenigans pulled with leadership+somehow combining Fiend of Possession( must be [baby-eating Evil]) with words of creation (must be [goody-two-shoes]).